Unknown Nations Podcast

Greg Kelley: 

Well, hello everybody and welcome to the Unknown Nations Podcast, highlighting what God is doing in the most spiritually dark places in the world. Today we are gonna be joined by a very special guest in a place that you've heard a lot about over the years. We are gonna drill into the great Commission perspective and look at it through the lens of what God is doing in this challenging country that we are talking about, the country of Iraq.

I'm joined by one of our leaders here. At Unknown Nations, but also we are joined by someone in the field who you're just gonna have to stick with us because you are gonna meet someone who's living in Iraq right now as we talk. Well, my name is Greg Kelley with Unknown Nations, where we have the honor to serve God by helping reach the most zero-access barrier ridden, spiritually antagonistic spoken word, reliant people, groups on the planet, giving birth to the church in impossible places.

So today's story, it's all about a place that you could call it impossible, but because of Jesus, he is moving and power in this place. And I'd like to just bring Randy in. Randy is a dear friend of ours and, and has been a partner for many years. Randy was a guy when he walked into the office, I don't know if you remember this moment, Randy or not, but because I've been doing this over 27 years, there's a few languages I know in people groups and this guy walks into our office and he starts talking about the Pashtun and Munoyaya and Yadev and, and all these people groups I've never heard another human being say.

And I'm like, “who are you?”

It's Randy. He has been on the mission field and some of the most challenging places in the world and has relationships with some precious, precious indigenous leaders, including our guests today. So Randy, wanna welcome you, my friend, to the Unknown Nation's Podcast. Glad to have you with us.

 

Randy: 

I'm glad to be here. I'm glad that we brought along my friend A. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Yes, yes. Well do our listeners a favor and just let them know a little bit about who A is and let's bring him into the show too. 

 

Randy: 

So I would love to introduce him. And I think if I'm describing A, the first thing I gotta say is, if you wanna know what Jesus looks like and what Jesus acts like, you look at A. I'm gonna put that as the best phrase I can think of giving anybody. And if any human being is worthy of it, I think actually is. 

So that's just who he is. And he's a guy who's been in the trenches spending his life, his money, his energy, everything he has in representing Jesus in the areas where he lived.

At a time when so much of the Christian population of Iraq and the Middle East in general have been believing. Here's a guy who isn't gonna leave, who won't leave, and he's gonna disdain and he is gonna keep doing it. And the third thing I'd say is I find it delightful that A and he'll explain more details of it, but he doesn't segment his ministry.

Thinking this is good work over here, and evangelism over there, and church planting in yet another place. He's an integrated package of Jesus representing an integrated package of Jesus in that place. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Beautiful. Beautiful. Well, that is certainly high praise brother. Hey buddy, you resemble Jesus.

That's high praise, man. So let's, these people are dying to hear from you. A. Tell us my friend, how has life been in Iraq. Praise the Lord. Thank you, Randy. 

 

A:

Iraq since a long time, always. We have always had wars here in our area, in old areas, not just in Iraq around us, like Turkey, Syria, Iran.

Many troubles we get here. But bless the Lord. I know Jesus. So since that time till now I'm serving him, I give him a promise. I will give you my life to serve you. So from that time till now, I was serving him in my heart. And not just in my area, but even the countries around Cosan.

 

Greg Kelley:

So when, when you mentioned your area, A, what part of Iraq are you living in and what sort of distinguishes that from other parts of Iraq? 

 

A: 

Yeah. I am living in the north of Iraq. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

So north of Baghdad, near Mosul. Is that what you said? 

 

A:

Yes. Near Mosul. Yes.

 

Randy: 

The ancient name for Mosul is Nineveh. And the Tomb of Jonah and the Tomb of Nhem are there. They used to be grander, but they got torn apart by ice. Iraq is a place, it's had the gospel longer than my Irish or English ancestors had it. Wow. So the Apostle Thomas. When Paul is heading up outta Israel and going west into the Roman world, the Apostle Thomas went through the iron curtain of his day, which was the Persian Empire and the barrier between the Roman Empire and Persian Empire.

He went through that by planting churches. He went right through Iraq, through places not all that far from where A's living, planted them through Iran and all the way down in India. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Yeah.

 

Randy: 

So most of Lord Nineveh is just south of where he lives. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Okay, got it. So we're, we're in an area that you're talking about a border with Syria. You're talking about a border with Iran. You're talking about a border with Turkey and that whole region, that is like the hotspot right there. It's a lot going on. 

When we're talking about ISIS and the civil wars and things of that, what's the environment like right now, A, as far as continued fighting? Is there civil war? Refugee crisis, all of the above. What's sort of the nature of things on the ground right now? 

 

A: 

Yes. Right now my city is safe, but we get a lot of war here from ISIS from Saddam region, Turkey, and people from Syria and Iran and like Hashd al Shabi. So we, everything's terrible there, right?

So we get a lot of problems now in my place around the half million refugees and IDPs. IDPs came from the Mosul area where ISIS were, and the refugees came from Syria and Iran and some of them from Turkey. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Okay. So, is this an area because of the instability in Syria where there's a lot of refugee camps or are they sort of, are they organized or is it just people just showing up, just trying to get away from the chaos that's in Syria and Iran and places like that?

 

A: 

Yes, there are a lot of camps here. Okay. We have four camps or Syrian camps and 12 Yazidi's IDP accounts here and two, two Iranian accounts. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Okay. Wow. And then inside of Iraq, what's the environment right now? Are there different factions that are sort of fighting? Is it politically stable? What is the actual condition among the Iraqi people?

 

A: 

It's not stable. No. We now fear Isis coming back to Iraq, fighting in the mountains between some Kurdish parties and Turkey. We had a lot of bombs last month north of the hook and around the hook. Fear from a Hashd al Shabi, which belongs to Baghdad, but under Iran. And so, no, no, no, it's not stable.

 

Greg Kelley: 

So from a standpoint of the suffering that's going on, it sounds like it's, it's just almost indescribable how massive it is. It sounds like there's a real opportunity to come alongside people. And I love what Randy said about the holistic approach, evangelism, humanitarian training, that you just view it as just as one, which as it should be.

But from your perspective, the humanitarian opportunity from the body of Christ, what opportunity do you see there? 

 

A: 

Yes. Right now what we are doing in the camps and even in the small villages and the cities, we teach them lessons, and small businesses will sometimes give them a food package, clothes, blankets, mattresses.

So we did a lot of things for refugees really. But they still need, especially in the camps, because the government of Iraq, they stop supporting the camps because of the economic problem between Stan and the central government in Iraq. So the camps, even the UN, stopped to help the camps right now because the problem is between Aronia and Baghdad and Syria. So the people in the camps, they really are in need right now. 

 

Randy: 

Part of what might help you understand that a little bit as well is that, A. He used that term as both an ethnic area with Kurdish peoples Notice I said peoples with an S on it. 'cause there's multiple kinds of Kurdish people, but it's also a mountainous area where things get pretty cold.

If you look out on the mountains, there's definitely snow capped in the winter and you get cold. Things get to freezing and below so. A lot of times when you think you're rock, you're thinking maybe desert and hot, but Kurdistan is actually quite cold, especially in the winter. So the need to be able to find some way to keep warm is quite significant.

 

Greg Kelley: 

When you guys, Randy and, and A, when, when you guys identify this need, it sounds just almost overwhelming. And I'm sure the UN and other sort of secular operations are at work trying to help the people in the camps. What actually just said is they're not, at this point, they're not.

So that was gonna be my question. When you look at the work that's taking place in these camps, are there any evangelical organizations that are trying to help or are they forbidden? Can they work there or is it just whatever minimal work's happening all from secular?

 

A: 

Yeah. Yes. And in the camp, especially in the camps we cannot have evangelists, the government, they don't allow us to make evangelism in the camps. We already did evangelism, but, but hidden. But anyway, it's not allowed for us to do evangelism. They just stopped us for two months. Two months ago, for two months because of this situation. 

So they told us if you do this again, we will close your activities in the area. So this, especially in the camps, we can do this outside the camps, but, our country is under Sharia. So, it's so dangerous to do this, but bless the Lord, a lot of people are coming to Jesus.

We have a lot of house churches now, four churches with buildings. 90 percent of those people are coming from Muslim backgrounds, and CDs. Wow. So, also we are working in Syria and Turkey and Iran. We have house churches right now. They need prayers and help. Right now it is in the Syria area. They are in trouble already. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Inside of Syria? 

 

A: 

Inside of Syria, yes. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Yeah. Well that's a big statement, brother. That's a big statement to consider what's going on in Iraq and we all have heard so many things about Iran, but for you to say Syria really should be on the forefront.

Is it easy for you to move across the border through the network to do ministry in Syria or is that difficult? 

 

A: 

No, it is very difficult, but we are doing it in some ways. 

 

Randy: 

You told me a few weeks ago about multiple groups of Muslim background believers in Syria who were, who asked for prayer because they were going to seek legal status from the new government.

So everybody else can know that at least. They exist and they've gone as far as that. Have you heard anything further? Was the request agreed to, or was it denied or is it still in process? 

 

A: 

Yes, in Syria and now they have two areas. They divided two areas, Kurdish areas and we call ISIS areas here.

So the Kurdish area, which belongs to the Kurdish government. Or Kurdish militia. So we are trying to open or get permission to open a church in that area, which is under Kurdish. So we are praying and continue trying to get this permission.  

 

Randy: 

I wanna clarify for everybody else there are churches that exist there, churches that exist are of two kinds.

On the one hand, there are historical churches where people have been born to an ethnic group and a religious group that call themselves Christian, and that has been true for 1500 years. There are Orthodox and other Christian groups like that. What we were referring to is the fact that there are Muslim background believers who are formed in house churches, and there's a fair number of those.

What A just said was about getting permission for there to be a legal, visible, structural, above ground kind of church of Muslim background believers. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

But that would be permission necessary in both Syria and Iraq. Would that be the goal or the hope? 

 

Randy: 

Yeah. This is particularly about Syria. And I think it's stunning that they would even think this is possible. And I think that's the measure of the hope the new government there has brought that this might even be possible. So it's to make Muslim background believers a legal and visible entity. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

So, that's a perfect scenario and I think that everybody would want that in a free environment.

But the reality of majority Muslim areas and leadership, obviously also when the underground church sort of comes out in the open. I would think they would be hesitant to do that even if they're getting official approval from the government that doesn't want to expose them. And it's not even so much, we see this in so many places around the world.

It's not so much what the government says. It's the vigilante enforcement of the mob kind of coming and attacking. How does that play out in a place like Syria and Iraq? 

 

Randy: 

If I can speak for A and he'll chime in later. So he mentioned Iraq being under a form of Sha law, but A is part of a legal and visible church.

 

Greg Kelley: 

Beautiful. 

 

Randy: 

And, and he has a legal entity that is allowed, we would call it an English NGO that is allowed to do good works in the name of Jesus. You can improve that A. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Describe that A, that how, what does that look like? That sounds amazing. 

 

A: 

Yes. By the way, we already have permission in our area.

We have permission from the government and three cities which to me are the hook and Zho trying to have, same thing in Soleimani in Syria. We can do it. But as I say, prayers and some support for that. But in our area, really in Kurdistan, if Iraq, we are okay with that. I got permission three years ago. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Wow. Well that's encouraging. Yeah, having the church being able to worship freely, that's a beautiful thing. And I know that God is moving A in Iraq and, and I'm sure that with that comes the need for training and equipping leaders. What's, what's your vision on that?

What does that look like? Because we know that in these places, I'm just looking at the Joshua Project statistic, and it says that 98% I. Of Iraq is among the unreached 0.27% evangelical, that would be followers of Jesus. So, it's pretty slim numbers, but nevertheless, as the gospel's expanding and people come to Christ, as you pointed out, the need for leaders is really critical. So what is sort of the strategy behind that in Iraq? 

 

A: 

Yes. I'm talking about my service here. Right now I have training every month for leaders. I have between 40 to 50 people every month training them to do things like house churches. So, they are coming every month for the meeting. And now we have around more than 100 house churches and, and Iraq area.

Let's say my vision is to go to other cities. And Soleimani in Iraq and moved to Syria more. We already have friends working in Baghdad and south, south of Iraq. So my vision is to reach all of Iraq and the region around Iraq. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Praise God. When I say there's a quarter of a percent, one quarter of 1% that are followers of Jesus in a country of probably oh, 46 million.

I think those are the last numbers I saw. And, and our brother here just said a hundred house churches. Randy, that's just got a. Bless you and put a smile on your face knowing there's work to be done. But how exciting is that? 

 

Randy: 

I was first there in 1994 and I met people who had eyes of faith that saw that coming. It wasn't there. But lots of good people have invested prayer, sweat, and blood into their lives. Invested in Bible translation, invested in ministry, invested in good works, and Jesus said, if I be lifted up, I will draw all men. UN and A is one, not the only, but there have been people who better lifting up Jesus and Jesus lived outright is attractive.

 

Greg Kelley: 

Hmm. Yes. Amen. Well, one of the ways Randy and ti, that people come to know Jesus is through the word of God, obviously, and we've, we've had some success through the power of the Holy Spirit as people have encountered audio bibles and micro SD cards. So, A, how can people be praying and what should they be aware about as it comes to, as it relates to the audio bibles and the languages of Iraq?

 

A: 

Yeah. We have a lot of people here. They cannot read. So really, I used audio Bibles before it was very successful in our area, especially for those living in the village and small cities. They didn't get an education yet. So still we are using this audio Bible, and we distributed a lot of them years ago.

We still need it. We use it for those people, they cannot read, especially we have a lot of ladies here, they cannot read and write. 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Hmm. What's your take on that, Randy? As far as the need and the strategic nature of how audio Bibles could. Could come alongside leaders like A, these other hundred house churches, if we equip them with audio bibles. What kind of an impact would you envision? 

 

Randy: 

Well, I think it's kind of an understatement to say that God knew what he was doing and the absolutely best apologetic I've experienced that I've seen is to let God's word speak for itself. And in our world in the West, there's a lot of time spent on issues of exactly what sense and in exactly what way is the Bible inherent.

And I think the more important question is that when we use the scriptures, they're self-authenticating. That I've seen Muslims and Hindus and Yazidis. And atheists and all kinds of people when they encounter what God actually said, it is compelling and it goes beyond somebody's argument. God speaks using his word and it, I would love it if you could think of those hundred house churches as embers of a fire and the sensible thing to do.

Is to grab gas cans and throw 'em on those embers. So flood the zone? 

 

Greg Kelley: 

Yes, yes. 

 

Randy: 

We've sent him a batch. They will get there sooner or later. A lot more.

 

Greg Kelley: 

Yeah. Dump gasoline on the fire. Amen. Amen. That's a great parting line right there, brother. Dump gasoline on the fire. And if you want the scriptural background, go to Isaiah 55 that says, “my word will not return void.”

So we are so grateful for what God is doing in Iraq. We're so grateful for A and Randy. Their passion, how God is using them. Brothers, I could talk to you all day, but unfortunately we don't have any more time on this episode, but we will talk about this more in the future. So thank you A and Randy for joining us on the Unknown Nations Podcast.

 

A:

Thank you very much for hosting us.

 

Greg Kelley:

God bless you guys. Well, friends, thank you for joining us today on the Unknown Nations Podcast. Visit our website at UnknownNations.Com to learn more about how you can get involved and get behind this beautiful work in Iraq and Syria. Subscribe. Follow. Share this with your friends and family and join us on this incredible journey of faith, hope, and transformation.

Join us in making Jesus known at the ends of the earth. The impact you can have is immeasurable, and together we can see God's kingdom expand into the darkest corners of the world. We'll catch you next time on the Unknown Nations Podcast.